The Troubles, reconciliation and peace process, with former Primate of All Ireland, Lord Robin Eames

Religion and reconciliation during and after the Troubles

The IoI team talks to the former Archbishop of Armagh and Anglican Primate of All Ireland, Lord Robin Eames about his experience during and after the Troubles with reconciliation and the peace process, his hopes for the future of the island, and his belief in ‘patient listening’ as a tool for reconciliation. Has the role and influence of the church declined? Has Northern Ireland been reduced to nothing more than a strategic pawn in the game of Brexit? How can we foster leadership that has the courage to choose reconciliation? Should a potential border poll be Northern Ireland’s priority at the moment? How do we deal with legacy issues? And we discuss the uses and limitations of the oft-used term, ‘sectarian’.

Scroll down to discover:

• Executive summary
• About the speaker and discussants
• Watch the conversation
• What was said?

Executive summary

• ‘Patient listening’ is crucial to promoting and finding reconciliation between divided communities. Listening doesn’t mean agreeing on everything, a sentiment he thinks Northern Ireland often questions. And the church can play a role in this process.
• In his role as Archbishop and Primate, he has tried to keep this formula at the centre of his ministry.
• The island of Ireland must learn from the lessons of the past by listening and understanding the suffering people have experienced, and vowing to move past this history.
• The church can play a key role in moderating these conversations and listening without agreeing.
• The importance of sport, espeically rugby, as the 'great leveller' in the island.
• Brexit has caused new divisions between the Republic and the UK, but has also underlined commonalities between communities and helped push conversations out of a localised perspective.
• Leaders must have the courage to push onwards even when they don’t have support, and to acknowledge that history doesn’t need to be repeated.
• Younger generations are ones that want to confine the past to the history books and look instead to the future.
• The legacies of the Troubles won't be solved by the new legislative proposals by the UK government.
• Northern Ireland is once again being used as a pawn in a wider strategic game between the UK and EU.

About the speaker

Lord Eames was elected Bishop of Derry and Raphoe in 1975, just three years after Bloody Sunday, and in a ground-breaking move, invited his Catholic counterpart, Edward Daly, to walk with him to his consecration. This spirit of reaching across cultural divides, even at moments where tensions couldn’t be higher, has defined Lord Eames’ spiritual work as he progressed to become the Archbishop of Armagh and Anglican Primate of All Ireland. Retiring in 2006, he now sits in the House of Lords as a cross-bench peer.

About the discussants

Eugenio Biagini is Professor of Modern and Contemporary History at the University of Cambridge and a Fellow of Sidney Sussex College.

Watch the conversation

What was said?

A “key part” of reconciliation is to “listen first”. Starting his career as a bishop in the aftermath of Bloody Sunday gave him the opportunity to bring a “real sense of patient listening” to his ministry and his gesture of friendship with Edward Daly grew into a public friendship. Lord Eames was “unashamed” to say the two differed on some opinions and considered it proof that “listening doesn’t necessarily mean agreeing”. He argued that sadly in Northern Ireland, the tradition has been to question this sentiment. For him, listening has to be part of the process of reconciliation, and this is a formula that guided him through his experiences in pastoral ministry during the Troubles.

On the future, Lord Eames was hopeful for a generation that has mostly grown up in peace. As they begin to hear and ask about history and what it means for the future, however, reconciliation has to remain at the roots. Reconciling two governments and people within Northern Ireland isn’t a simple task, and Lord Eames thinks this is where the Church can play a role in listening without agreeing. He has no problem “reaching out hands” as he did to Edward Daly and believes that “the Ireland of the future has to be an island that listens, an island that looks to the past but says on its knees ‘we’re not going to let the mistakes of the past jeopardise the opportunities of the future’”. For Eames, “hope is eternal” and an outlook that says ‘the future is ours to make’.

People, Professor Eugenio Biagini pointed out, have not always been eager to listen and engage. Lord Eames’ 1992 book, Chains to be Broken, portrayed a society in which listening was difficult. How has the situation changed since then, and particularly since Brexit? Lord Eames thinks the most significant change is a “growing reluctance to get dragged back into the past”. Although there are people on the fringes who still think violence is the only answer, Eames talked about the new generation who prefer to see history confined to books, and want education to focus on the challenges ahead, what the new Europe is like, the climate crisis, worries about healthcare. The “dimension of thinking is widening”, taking people away from a localisation of politics. Although Brexit has driven a wedge between the UK and the Republic, he thinks it’s also made people realise through listening that they have a lot in common.

For Lord Eames, the Church can play a key role as moderator in these listening processes. Since the 1990s, it’s influence has been in decline, however. Eugenio asked if it can still play the same role it did during the Troubles? Lord Eames responded that a lessening influence of the structure of the Church doesn’t mean there is a lessening influence on individuals. He recounted his role in the Downing Street Declaration, where he advised the British and Irish governments to include a statement on consent. Consent went on to become a central theme of the peace process. Eugenio followed up on the Downing Street Declaration and noted that another central theme was trust, and that a key step to building trust in Northern Ireland was the declaration that Britain didn’t have selfish or strategic aims in the region. Has Brexit undermined this claim? Has Northern Ireland not returned to being a major strategic pawn? Lord Eames thought this sentiment was fair and that people on the street were feeling like “chattel” between the EU and the UK. He pleaded that we cannot rewrite history and must learn from it. He worries that UK politicians are willing to lose the lessons of the Troubles.

Turning to his experience of the peace process more generally, Lord Eames spoke of the spirituality that drove him, and the core idea that all humans are made in God’s image. This idea drove him to continue searching for commonalities amongst the division. He also spoke about his relationship with Desmund Tutu who played a key role in his own country’s division and peace process. He recounted that Rev. Tutu had once told him that no two divisions were the same, and so Northern Ireland and South Africa can’t be easily compared. The common denominator, however, is people, and this is what Lord Eames has always carried with him.

The conversation turned to leadership, with Eugenio asking what gifts Lord Eames sees as essential for leaders? Lord Eames gave three answers; the gift to recognise the past and realise it doesn’t have to repeat itself; the courage to acknowledge past mistakes and failings to accept they don’t have to be repeated; and the courage to accept that a higher power can guide you and make it worthwhile to strike out ahead of others. Barry asked what we can do to foster this courage? Lord Eames responded that the question brings up the topic of support. Leadership always begins with support but sometimes one has to strike out ahead, like David Trimble had to. He again turned to his notion of ‘patient listening’ and argued that this can help guide leaders to notice the small signs that things are going their way and it is worthwhile to continue pushing forward.

Questions from the audience covered a range of issues, from how to deal with legacies and what the Troubles were truly about, to the role of sport in reconciliation and the current divisions in the Church.

On legacy, Lord Eames considered it the “most important” issue currently being looked at. He argued that it cannot be dealt with by signing new legislation and not realising the sense of human hurt involved in these cases. Many families are still waiting for justice from the Troubles and some of them just want to know what happened. Learning lessons from the past doesn’t stop us from looking to the future with hope.

On coping with the darkest days of the Troubles, Lord Eames stressed that his faith never suffered because of the Troubles and that he turned to most often a “personal conviction that what was happening was wrong” but that “there was a God who cared” and therefore so should he.

Dr Niamh Gallagher questioned the extent to which the term ‘sectarian’ can be useful. Lord Eames responded that so often the island of Ireland’s 'troubles' have been dismissed because it is “divided by religion”, a sentiment he has never fully accepted. He thinks that violence becomes sectarian when a political label is linked to religion and in that case it’s an appropriate word. He thinks the island’s history and suffering has been dismissed because of its labelling as a religious divide and that he’s tired of hearing it because to him, it’s as much as about politics. In response to another question about whether the Troubles were caused by inequality, Lord Eames heartedly agreed, saying that the conflict was about the quality of life, respect, and the importance of consent.

John Cushnahan, former leader of the Alliance party, asked whether a border poll would be premature and that an essential prerequisite would be to unite Northern Ireland first and for its political institutions to function properly? Lord Eames wants to see issues like a border poll be put on a “second footing” to an attempt to heal divisions first. He added that the Republic didn’t want the responsibility landed on them of a community which is still divided.

On the role of denominational education in perpetuating tribal attitudes, Lord Eames praised grammar schools as a space where children of different backgrounds mix and interact. For him, these schools are an expression of hope and all moving away from labelling communities is positive.

A keen rugby player himself, Lord Eames considers sport one of the “strongest binders” and creators of friendships that he knows. He stressed that some of his happiest memories of his youth were meeting new people through sport and that it has been, and will continue to be, one of the “best levellers” in society.

Eugenio brought the discussion to a close with a final thought on the developments in world churches that have brought new divisions, e.g. on sexuality. Lord Eames responded that more important than structures is the value of persons and that people will change their attitude. What he thinks the churches are learning is that in the past they’ve sometimes been too quick to speak and too slow to listen.